Speaker 1 (00:00.098)
Welcome to PBL podcast for administrators. Brought to you by Magnify Learning, your customized PBL partner. For a decade of experience with you in the trenches, we are bringing you this top rated educational podcast designed for visionary school administrators seeking to transform their schools with project-based learning. Launch your vision, live your why, and lead inspired. Here's your host, Ryan Stoyer.
to the P. I'll simplify.
Speaker 2 (00:09.336)
partner.
Speaker 2 (00:30.094)
That's right. I'm your host Ryan Stoyer and you've got a leadership guest episode today. And today we're bringing back Marianne Renner. She's been on the podcast before when our Ted talk came out. She's got a new book coming out. So I want to make sure that you got to hear from her. So Marianne, if you don't know her, is a highly sought after leadership coach, trainer and speaker who helps growth minded leaders. That's all of us on this podcast remove self-imposed barriers so they can lead with more confidence and courage in her new book.
is called Self Talk, 10 stories you tell yourself that hold you back. And before I bring Mary Ann on, I just want to tee it up with, this is for all of us, right? Like we all have self talk. I don't care if you're the superintendent, the principal, the teacher in the classroom, we've all got stories we tell ourselves and they're either helping us or hurting us. So Mary Ann, I'm super excited to have you on the podcast. Thanks for being with us.
Ryan, thank you for having me. I feel really honored to be here and I'm just really excited to have this conversation with you.
Me too. And your Ted talk, you talked about some work you did with an afterschool program and like you crushed it with them. But I feel like this book on self-talk, I feel like this is like your jam. Like this is your message to the world. Is that right? Am I right on that? Like tell us about this book.
you're spot on a thousand percent, which you know, it's funny because I have this conversation with educators and education leaders and which by the way, I have a very unique definition of leadership. So to me, leader, the word leader means going first. And so you may have a position on an org chart or a title that is a leadership title with people reporting to you, but
Speaker 1 (02:19.766)
A leader is anyone who chooses to be a leader by saying, this is the decision that I know is right, that I'm going to make and everyone else can follow me and the example I'm setting. So we're all leaders.
It's so good. So the teacher in front of the classroom, right. Or the school leader in front of a staff, right. It's who's going to go first. And the reason I knew this is kind of, I don't want to say you're crowning joy, but because you've got a lot of work that you're going to be speaking about, but I think this is where you're going to be. Cause you've always had a positive message, right? Like it's always been a part of you, but I shouldn't say always as you've been speaking, right. You've used your story, right. To bring positivity and maybe we'll go back to your story and where this all came from. But since we've known each other, like,
always brought a positive message. So you've been talking to other people's lives. And now I feel like you're like, wait a minute, how do we get other people to like improve their self-talk? That's where this kind of came from.
Yes. Okay. So I'll go back to my, my history and my story and how this book came to be. And the book, as you mentioned is self-talk, 10 stories that you tell yourself that hold you back. And I've had hundreds, if not thousands of conversations with leaders and high performers over the years. And so I have seen these sort of categories of these 10 stories and
These are also stories that I told myself at one time. So everything that's in the book, we've got a lot of, you know, research back to information and it's lots of stories, but I share very openly that for the first three decades of my life, I struggled with debilitating depression and addiction. So the depression came first and
Speaker 1 (04:10.542)
I did everything. I just wanted to make the bad feelings go away. And I think at the end of the day, the decisions that we all make are to get a feeling or to avoid a feeling. And that was the case with me. And I tried workaholism to make the bad feelings go away. That didn't work. Then I tried alcoholism, maybe not even in that order, but that certainly didn't work. And over these years, I mean, I, from age 11 until age,
40 I'll date myself. I'm not shy about that. I, I really struggled to the point where the doctor said, this is a chronic condition. The best chance you have is to manage it, to not get worse. And it was, you know, I mean, everything's as low as you could get suicide attempts, hospitalizations, everything. But in my journey and my search and trying all these things, I read all these books and I,
Did all these, I tried everything and what I found was that when I changed my self talk, everything changed more. But now I should probably give a disclaimer. If you have a mental health issue, you should seek medical attention for me. More powerful than any medication I ever took, any treatment that I received was the stories I told myself. It was my mindset.
what I told and it changed everything. I all of the depression, everything my whole life has changed. And so I thought, gosh, if this worked for me, I wonder if this would work for other people. So I started sharing the message with individual coaching clients and leaders and workshops that I delivered. And I started seeing the same outcomes for them. They didn't have depression, but you know, they were unfulfilled in their career. You know, educators especially are dealing with
so much, maybe their mental health, mental health of the kids in the classroom today's unprecedented, those challenges, the demands, the administrative needs. mean, trying to just accomplish the day-to-day functioning in the classroom is so challenging. And I just started seeing all kinds of outcomes change for the people I worked with. And so that's when I decided to put it all in a book.
Speaker 2 (06:30.988)
Yeah. Let's I mean, so we're friends and it goes back a ways, right? So I knew you're, I know your story and I just wanted people to hear a little bit of like, you you're not Jim Rome's daughter and like John Gordon isn't your uncle. You know I mean? Like, like, know, all these positive talk pieces, right? But it's not like it wasn't natural, right? There was, it came from a need, right? Of like, Hey, some things need to change. this was the vehicle.
And think that's an important part to your story is right.
And that is, I mean, that's, you know, I, I've just said for so long, I mean, to have been at the rock bottom and to have gone through, mean, like I said, you know, three decades, I mean, it was about from age 11 was the first time I remember crying out loud and saying, God, please let me die in my sleep. And I remember that 11 years old and night after night and all the way, you know, up and down like that until age 40, but
Yeah, I've been through it. And I always tell people if that kind of transformation happened for me, imagine the implications for somebody that's not at that rock bottom, someone in the classroom, somebody who just feels stuck in any way, or form.
Yeah, that's right. And that's, that's why I say this book is for everybody. Like you're the master teacher. You went through, you know, from rock bottom to, the top. I mean, you're a high flyer. Like you're speaking all over the country. You're writing books. Um, you've got Tedx talk, like you're doing all those things and you still have self-talk, right? Like that's still part of your programming. And I know the people that you're working with, you're not, the people you're working with are also high flyers or maybe they're good and they want to be great.
Speaker 2 (08:14.426)
If you want to go from good to great, self-talk is part of that issue, right? It's something you need in your tool bag. talk to us about some of these stories. You've got 10 stories in the book that we need to overcome through self-talk. So can you give us a couple that kind of stick out with people?
Yes. I would say there are two that really stand out. One is some variation of I'm not good enough.
Yep.
And in, the way, you when you talk about the people that I'm working with, I mean, the high performers, mean, have individual coaching clients that come to me and this is where I really get my research from because they're being completely honest in this sort of safety of the small private intimate conversation. And these very high performers, you know, from managers to executive level leaders and everything in between.
and they have everything going on and then they come to me and I'm not good enough. I don't have the same degree as the person next to me or I don't come from the same kind of family or economic background. And they sort of secretly confide in me this big secret that they have that they lack confidence and they have self doubt and they struggle with uncertainty. And I want to shake them and say,
Speaker 1 (09:35.832)
Do you know how many one-on-one conversations I have with people just like you that say the same thing? Yeah.
We've all got that right. it's, if I just get out of debt, then I won't, then I'll be there. Right. Nope. Yes. It's still, still not enough. If I just get, you know, if I go from teacher to department head, then I'll, I'll have it, you know, hit that five year mark. Then I'll feel like I've arrived. So it's universal. Isn't it? That is what it is.
Universal. is right. And what's universal is there is some circumstance outside of ourselves. So there's a situation and then we tell ourselves a story about that situation. And that's where we get into trouble because our stories are oftentimes work against us, not for us. And so here's a process. And I have this in, in the book, it's chapter 14 for anyone who wants the book, but I call it the seer.
process and I like sear is an acronym and I like it because these stories we tell ourselves are sort of seared into our brains, but we can we can redo them and create new stories and we sear in but we tell ourselves a story about the situation that story evokes an emotion and that emotion is what informs our action and Then the action gives us the result So we wanted a new result
to reverse engineer it. We want a new result. We need to take a different action. If we want a different action, change the emotion. Because we're all trying to just take actions that give us a feeling or avoid a feeling. And if we want a different emotion, let's change the story.
Speaker 2 (11:19.414)
Awesome. Can you give us an example? I think of one, but give us an example.
So here's an example I hear in the workplace. Let's say the situation is, let's say I'm part of an important project at work, whether it's in the classroom or the business office or wherever you are, or maybe it's at home with your community. So you're part of an important project and somebody sends out an email meeting invitation about the project and you don't get the invite. That's the situation.
What do you tell yourself as a result of not getting this invite? What are some things you think people might tell themselves?
Right, they could say like, I can't believe they left me out.
Are they? About I'm am I not good enough? Do they not value my opinion? Maybe they're trying to take over the project. They're trying to push me out all those things. Yeah. And then after telling yourself that story, how does that make you feel?
Speaker 2 (12:04.43)
Why did they do that? I not good enough?
Speaker 2 (12:20.59)
Right. Does not evoke a positive emotion, right? Shame, guilt.
you're angry, shame, guilt, resentful, all those things. And then what action might someone take as a result? I hear things like, I mean, what would you, what would you do?
always think of passive aggressive would be like the next move, right?
Yes, I fire off an email maybe or maybe I shut down. I'm never leaving my office. I'm not talking to that person anymore. And then what kind of outcome is that going to bring?
and nothing positive. Now I'm not collaborating with the people that are decision makers. I'm isolating myself.
Speaker 1 (12:54.83)
Yep. All those things. So now maybe they're not interested in communicating with me anymore because I'm, you know, a stinker. Yeah. Um, you know, so, but if, but if I tell myself a different story, uh, one that's more positive, one that serves me and the greater good of all, I always like to say, um, then you know, let's say I think, Oh, maybe they just forgot. So
If they just forgot, I don't feel angry or resentful. Maybe I just send them an email and say, Hey, I noticed this went out. Would you like me on the call? And then they say, yeah, sorry. We just forgot about that. And then they think, Marianne's great person. We're so glad she reached out to us and she added so much value at the meeting and then you get a promotion. I mean, or whatever, but, the stories really have that kind of an impact.
Yeah, that's right. That's so good. Cause you could spend your whole time just sulking over this thing. And it was just a mistake. Right. Or they, you know, I get this all the time. There's an email that gets sent to Ryan, right. But it was a different Ryan. So was like some meeting I'm not supposed to be on. And I just think like, just that, like, does the other Ryan that's supposed to be in this meeting, like, does he feel left out? Cause he just got left out unintentionally, right? Right. Right. He could be telling himself the story and really it was just an accident. Yeah. That's so powerful. So just.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
just reframing the story that we're telling ourselves. So when we do this process, are we looking for results that we don't like and then working our way back through the actions, the emotions, the story, is that how we do it?
Speaker 1 (14:16.588)
Hmm?
Speaker 1 (14:27.714)
That's one way you can do that. You can reverse engineer it in that way. You can also, you know, just sort of stop it at the emotion. So lots of times people won't be aware that they're telling themselves stories. In fact, most of the time it's that's part of the problem is that we have blind spots around the stories we're telling ourselves, but we usually are acutely aware of the fact that my chest is tight. I'm feeling anxious, right? My face feels hot cause I'm feeling angry. And so if you can notice,
a sort of physical reaction that can serve as an alarm for you. So if my alarm clock goes off in the morning, I still have an alarm clock, even though have my phone, that alarm is telling me to take an action. It's informing me something needs to happen. In that case, wake up, get up. So your emotions just kind of use that as an alarm. Okay, okay, this is going on. Now let me step back and say what
What was I telling myself that led to this emotion? So you can sort of stop it right there before you get to the result and think, man, I wish I would have done the whole thing differently.
Yeah, that's good. So yeah, help us with that. When that comes, like, do I just need to try to work to kind of reset my default or like, just had like an alarm or a notification. then can I just choose the emotion?
You so this is a, this is a huge question. and so, you know, like I just did a training with about 50 leaders in, in the workplace. And we were talking about your, you have this logic part of your brain and then you have the emotional part of your brain. And by the way, both of them come with us when we step into the workplace, we don't get to say I'm taking off my emotion hat and leaving it in the car. so we kind of have to, I always say we have to talk about the F word.
Speaker 1 (16:21.218)
feelings. but, but it can be like having a six ton elephant in that emotional part of our brain. And, the logic is like, a rider riding on top of that elephant and the elephant wants to go a certain way. It can be really hard to make him turn. So sometimes, you know, there are a lot of answers to that question and sometimes it's being aware.
and saying, am not going to take an action based on this emotion. I'm just not going to take an action because yeah, I hear this all the time. I got an email and I'm steamed about it and I'm going to wait before I respond. And then that waiting could be two minutes. It could be 24 hours depending on the response.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:09.132)
Right. You can even type it, just leave it in the draft folder.
Yes. Yes. Yeah. I mean, so there's there are lot of ways. So, you know, to change the emotion. I listen, I give people three three actions that they can take to try to turn that six ton elephant in the moment, because that can be really hard. we, you know, listen, we're as educators and education leaders, like we get triggered in the moment a lot. But I say three things. Breathe, move and laugh.
So all those things can change your brain chemistry. The breathing that I talk about in the book is also known as a four by four breathing or box breathing, which is what Navy SEALs do. And when they're in a high stress situation to try to think logically and rationally and bring themselves into that space, it's breathing into the count of four, holding that breath for four counts and then exhaling for four counts.
and then you do it four times. And that process takes about probably less than 60 seconds. And I just did this, we did this together as a group in a workshop. And I said, on a scale of one to five, how differently do you feel afterward? And people were like four, five. So in the moment, it can change your emotions pretty quickly.
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:37.688)
But I love, I love that you're in this space of self-talk, Mary. I'll just be real honest. Cause it does, sometimes it feels like I don't think everybody buys in, right? And it's okay to be wrong. I'm not mad at you for being wrong, right? But, but you just gave me like Navy SEALs do this. Like you're, you're working with, again, like high flyers or government officials or educational partners. Like you're working with people that are operating at a high level. And these are things that we do. Right.
at a high level and you need to do them. So in your book, you've got three parts. The third part is how to soar beyond your stories. So let's kind of go there. Let's say we've kind of identified some of our stories. We need to change, either change the story of how we see it so we can change the emotion, change the action to change the result. So how do we soar beyond the stories? are some tips there?
So there's a chapter in that section on being vulnerable. That is a really hard thing for people to do, really hard. So once you, if you've sort of mastered your stories, you kind of know how to do all of this. Going beyond is showing up in an authentic way, in a vulnerable way. And
especially people in leadership positions and they'll say things to me like, how do I, how do I show up? Let's say even like for an educator in the classroom, well, how am I going to be vulnerable? I need to be the example and the leader for the classroom, but there's a way to be both. There's a way to say, Hey, we're talking about this big, scary thing that's going on in the news. And, you know, maybe all the kids are talking about it and you know, there's, you know, just some
sort of chaos or disaster. And the teacher would say something like, listen, I know you feel this way. I feel it too, but here's what we're going to do about it. We're going to learn, we're going to do some deep breathing. We're going to move our bodies. takes seven minutes to change your brain chemistry, to move your body for seven minutes. So you don't have to do a big workout. You can just do some jumping jacks or just, you know, do something simple.
Speaker 1 (20:48.466)
but the teacher, you know, or, you know, any person, even in your personal life with your, your kids or whoever, if you're leader of the community, yeah, I, get it. I, I'm, feel it too, but, but as the leader, then you're going to set the example on how to navigate through it. So showing up in a vulnerable way is a big part of soaring beyond your stories.
And I think that's part of, part of leadership too, right? Like you mentioned, it's who goes first, right? So we need to be able to show vulnerability as leaders and kind of get comfortable with that. Sometimes there's a bravado or this overconfidence. I've found with, with my staff and even principals that I'm coaching with, I don't mind saying, Hey, you know, I feel kind of weak at AI right now. Like, I'm not sure where it's going to go, what we should be teaching it. But you know what? I'm going to take a course on it, which I just started by the way.
Right. So it's like, I don't mind showing the vulnerability, but I'm also going to show kind of how I deal with that. Yeah. I don't think I'm trying to cover up on that. Do think I'm all right with that? I like to show the vulnerability, also, here's how I deal with that.
Absolutely. 1000%. And that's what it's all about because here when we're telling ourselves the story, I'm not good enough. The first thing we do is put up a wall because I don't want you to know that I think I'm not good enough. So now I'm going to overcompensate. I might show up as, you know, I'm full of myself, even though I'm not.
or the opposite. Yeah. I might show up and not say anything because I'm, terrified of people seeing who I really am. I had this, coaching client come to me and she was a, like a middle level leader in her organization. And she had this, I'm not good enough. She did all of the things. The tool has dozens and dozens of tools to help people with their stories. And she did all of these things. And to me today, she's the CEO of the organization.
Speaker 1 (22:46.414)
But before she got there, you know, she would say, Marian, I could never let someone know this about me. I could never let someone know that about me. And I said to her, in the book, she's there's an example of her story in the book, Elizabeth. And I said, you know, about my, my backstory, the depression, the addiction. I said, does that make you think less of me or want to work with me less or hear my insights less? And she said, no.
I feel more connected to you. And I said, that's how it works. Because as the leader, if you want people to follow you, you need to connect with them on a human level.
Yeah, that's super good. And just going full circle then to kind of your definition of leader is like, it's the one that goes first. Right. If we want the people that we're leading, go ahead.
That's the one that goes first. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:39.678)
When I was little, we used to play, we always play outside. didn't have any money. We didn't really have very much. But mom would say, go outside and play, go outside, go outside and play. And we'd play all these, you know, did you ever play these childhood games? We'd play tag freeze tag play, you know, whatever red light, green light. But we used to play this game called Follow the Leader and one kid stood up in front and, know, they jump on one leg. You had to jump on one leg. They tapped their head. You tapped your head. They went first and we all just had to do what they did. Right. And that's that's leadership.
I want to go out and influence how people behave around me. And I do that by showing up in a way that is authentic and a way that is truthful and vulnerable. um, and, but to get there, like that's the beyond story and beyond the stories to get there. I've got to figure out how to change. What are these stories I'm telling myself and how do I change them?
Yeah, that's so good. I wish that at the end of the book, like, then we could be done with this whole process.
Never. I'm never going to listen as long as we're breathing. And if you're an earthling, you know, you come from earth. Yeah. But but this is the beauty of this book. So you get the book, read it cover to cover. But then you put it on it on your shelf and then you pull it out. Like, what do I need today? So you can pull out and read just the chapter that you need for that day, because usually we're in different variations of some of the different stories and different times in our journey. We're struggling with different things.
And so that's kind of the beauty of the tools and resources in the book. You can sort of cherry pick as you need them.
Speaker 2 (25:14.232)
Yeah, so if I need to think positive or act as if or own a role, right? I just pick those out. That's so good because you and I, we have similar beliefs around thinking positively, right? And the power of that just because we've seen work in our lives, right? But it still surprises me that I still need to do it. You know what I mean? It's like, but don't I need? And it's like, I totally believe what you're saying. It's like, we do, it's just, it's an everyday thing. It's just like working out. It's just.
Right?
Speaker 2 (25:42.274)
Yeah. Like taking a shower. You're going to keep doing it. so I like that this is a reference book too.
It is a reference book and it is exactly like working out because somebody, I just had a conversation right before this one around like, you know, how, do you do it? And, and somebody said, I'm a work in progress. And I said, it's just like working out. You got to put in the reps. Okay. If you go, went to the gym today and I did some leg press machine, but I can't look at my legs and say, did they get bigger? Did they get strong? Right. You just have to put it in the time and put in the practice. And over time you start to notice the change.
And you know, another really common story is any variation of it's not fair. It's a big one. And that's that chapter called own your role that you referenced is these are the chapter titles are these are the tools that you use when you're telling yourself the particular story. And that's the tool that goes with it. It's not fair. And when you're telling yourself
you know, something like that. Usually, and not often we don't use those exact words. We might say, I hate it that I can't believe it that how could they hear they go again. I those are all different ways that at the end of the day, what we're really saying is it's not fair. and that's, that could be a real sabotaging story because now we just basically in our mind, there's nothing we can do.
Right. Whatever's not fair. You're giving your power to whatever that thing is. It's owning your role. And now I own all of that and I get the power.
Speaker 1 (27:14.239)
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (27:19.286)
Yes. I learned, I'll tell you a quick story if we have time, how I learned that I was meeting with my AA sponsor, Brenda, she was a high powered attorney, very professional, you know, and so she said, Marion, I want you to go home and I want you to take out a sheet of paper and make a list of every person who ever wronged you and the circumstances around that. Like, I like this. I was so excited. I was going to...
I wrote, let me tell you, Ryan, I filled an entire legal pad of note paper. I wrote every name. So I went back the next week. So excited to show Brenda my list of everyone who wronged me all those years. And she didn't seem nearly as impressed as I thought she should be. But instead she said, now next to every one of those names, I want you to write your role in the situation. I couldn't believe it.
It took me a while to figure out that she was really teaching me that in every situation, I have a choice. How I respond, how I show up and in that choice is really where the magic is to change the outcome.
Yeah, super good. I want to give people, uh, all your resources here in a second, like all the URLs and all that stuff, uh, for sure. So they can reach out and book you to speak and, and, and get your book as it comes out here in a couple of months. Um, but before we do this exercise, this exercise metaphor, and I don't want to take it too far, but there's also the idea that like getting into this idea of a self-talk and positivity, like when you get into exercise, it's really hard at first, right? Like you might be sore, it takes some extra work.
and you kind of hit a groove of where it makes sense. Am I taking the metaphor too far or is self-talk kind of the same thing?
Speaker 1 (29:05.504)
It helps. Self-talk is a lot of the same thing. In fact, I have multiple stories in there, my own life that relate to exercise because in a former life, I was a personal trainer and a bodybuilder and there are a lot of metaphors. but one of the things that I talk about is in the beginning, it takes willpower and discipline, just like exercise, but willpower and discipline won't get you, take you forever because it also takes a lot of energy.
So it's really important to develop habits. So there's a whole chapter in there on habits. And that is the same thing with exercise. So you've got to apply these tools, start small, things that you could do for a long time, practice them daily, practice them the same time every day. So a lot of similar principles to starting an exercise routine.
Yeah. Okay. That makes sense to me. Affirmation, self-talk. Like at first it feels kind of silly and a little bit goofy. It's just like, you have to get past it. Right. Just feels awkward. That's why I just kind of keep reassuring like our listeners that we do this, right? This is something about this. It's what we do.
Yeah, awkward.
Speaker 1 (30:17.75)
Right, right. Why is it, Ryan, that it feels so comfortable to use negative words against ourself? Like, I'm not good enough. I'm not smart enough. I can't believe I did that. I'm so stupid. Why is that so comfortable?
That's so good. Like I just, that just hit me right there. It's like, we're doing self-talk anyway, right? Like self-talk is happening. It's just whether we choose, whether it helps us or not. Right.
Yes, yes, I would never say to my godson if he misses a shot in basketball. You're so stupid. I can't believe you did that.
Right. We say it to ourselves all the time, right? Yeah. my goodness. That's so good. All right. So the book comes out May 6th. We'll put all the links in the show notes, but where else can people find you, Miriam? Where else can we connect people to you?
So here's what I would say, go to my website. It's my name, maryannrenner.com slash self-talk will take you to a page where you can start reading free chapters right away. can download, I've got some free chapters of the book. I've got a great workbook you can download. has every tool in the book. And like I said, there are dozens and dozens. You can get them all in the free workbook.
Speaker 1 (31:26.764)
So all of that stuff is there. And then you can surf around that site and find other resources too. But for sure, the book and the workbook, you got to have it. You're going to love it.
Yeah. Okay. So we'll put it in the show notes that'll all be there for, all of our listeners. And it comes out in May, which means that you can book and you better hurry. You can book Marianne to speak over the summer event or like on the backend, like July, August, like to launch the year for your organization or your school. Like you need Marianne there.
May I also may I let you in on a little secret? Yes, I have early advanced reader copies of the book. So if somebody wants to book me for an event, I have access to books before May 6th if they want to get do something really quickly or even a virtual training. And we can have books shipped to wherever you want pretty easily. So I love it. Just. Yeah.
I love it. That only happens right here on the podcast folks. Like you're getting it now. real. Teachers, your colleagues, you know you've got some self-talk that you need to change. Principals, like your staff, they're going, everybody has self-talk pointing in the right direction. Like it just changes your culture. So Mary Ann would be a great keynote. Mary Ann, thank you for being on the podcast. Super excited. Super excited for your book to come out. This is so good.
Thank you. Thank you. And I just have to thank you, Ryan, for having me. It's just been an absolute delight to be here with you and speak into your audience and have this conversation.
Speaker 2 (32:58.478)
It's so good. All right, friend. Thank you. All right, listeners. You just heard really just a quick blurb about self-talk by Marianne Renner. And this is a book that you need. Again, leaders, we're going to go first. So whether you're leading a classroom or a school, your, your kids have self-talk. We all have stories that drive our emotions and our actions and then our results and education. are in the business of changing the results of, of our kids in our community. So
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (33:26.616)
This absolutely is 100 % relevant. Reach out, look in the show notes to get a pre-copy of Marianne's book. Comes out May 6th. If you want something before then, we'll put an email in there too where you can reach out to Marianne and you can get something before it comes out and you can get her booked by the end of the year. All right, go out and lead inspired.
That's just
what I needed to bring PBL to my school.
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Speaker 1 (33:56.92)
bottom, tap to rate with five and select write a review. Then be sure to let us know what was most about that episode. Your review helps the next inspired leader just like find their why and lead inspired.
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